Ogres EoG

So, this was my first ever Haven game, and, as I usually do, I had a look at the stats before it started. I was amazed to find that I had been given the best (according to stats) country to play as, but I still decided to play as aggressively as I could, as I noticed that if the Ogres don't develop quickly they'll be cornered, much as the Knights were.

Year 1
I formulated a strategy to ally the Elves and demilitarize TRL, as that was my weakest point. As the Magicians had also contacted me almost instantly with an offer of an alliance against the Leprechauns, I decided my best chance would be to go west. I sent the Elves a message to this effect, but they didn't reply for a long time, during which the Leprechauns had contacted me, very enthusiastically speaking about an alliance. I decided to play them off against one another in the first year and see what happened.

Meanwhile, in the East, I made an alliance with the Samurai against the Nomads. As, eventually, the Elves had replied and accepted my DMZ proposal, the Nomads were the biggest threat to me, and they weren't talking - from how the first few moves went, I would say they weren''t talking to anyone. I said that I would send one of my armies West to show that I was sincere in the alliance proposal, and the Samurai accepted.

After the Spring move, I saw that the Nomads were in an easily-takable position by the Samurai, so I asked them to support themselves in, and, to my surprise, they agreed, leaving Forbidden City open to me and most of their western flank undefended. This was to be their downfall. In the West, I kept out of the fighting and watched as the Leprechauns gained the advantage by taking an Elf Home SC. This decided who I was to be allied with, and that alliance lasted the game.

At the end of Year 1, I was top with a three build move, joint with the Faeries. From this early lead I managed to stay ahead or joint with the Faeries, the other leader for the entirety of the game.

I'll continue this soon, I have to go now. I'd be interested to hear other's opinions on the game.

Magicians, EoG:
As one who despises large games such as Haven, I would normally never join a game as such. it was simply the fact that there was one spot open that seemed so appealing to me XD
Early Game:
I did not want fleets. I did not want to get stuck down fighting the Pirates spending 8 years contending over the High Seas. instead, I went north towards the trolls. The trolls and I originally agreed on me getting Cyriss and he Grendel, and by the end of the year, neither of us got either of them. this was the start of the arguing. the simple fact was neither of us trusted the other. hence, we both built armies and lunged them towards Grendel. At the end of the second year, I had Cryriss and he Grendel, as originally promised. but I had a leg up on him, for I had grabbed two external centers, while he only gained one other then Grendel. I also had a very appealing offer to move towards the Undead with the Leprechauns. In Autumn 3 I grabbed skellington with a convoy and now had three units fighting the Undead. although the Trolls were progressing in the north, I decided to ignore them atm. With 5 came me taking all of the Undeads home centers, and progress in the north.
At this point I was highly unnerved by the Ogre-Lep alliance(Leggers) and so began speaking with the Fairies about an alliance to combat them. We concluded that the best would be for him, I, the Gnomes, and the Rogues to clean up all other factions, then to focus on the Leggers.
Mid Game:
With the Pirates help, the Trolls fell by Autumn 7. by Autumn 8 the Pirates were on their knees thanks to a swift offensive by the Fairies, Gnomes, and the Leggers.
The Cleanup:
Spring 10ish: Fairies, Gnomes, Leggers, Rogues, Magacians, Knights. our goal was a draw with the leggers, and only the Leggers. of course, the Leggers had a stipulation: the Rogues must go.
At this time the Leggers were just holding. not advancing anywhere, just waiting patiently for the Rogues to die. I will admit I was very unnerved and so I claimed positions like Far Far Away, Mermaids Lagoon, and Skellington.
A Hefty Autumnal Strike in 10 crippled the Rogues,and he was down to two centers in 11. One year later, the game was Drawn, and he was not in it.
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That's all from the Magacians, I would really like to hear the Fairies, so LakersFan, if your reading this...

Faeries EoG:

This was my second Haven game played. I started this game by trying to form alliances or NAP's with all of my neighbors. I was lucky in that the Rogues were trustworthy and didn't go after one of my home SC's in Fall 1. This enabled me to get a +3 right from the start.

I decided that I wanted to expand northwards initially, as I figured that would keep the Barbarians from coming south at me. The Barbarians right away said they wanted both Kingdom of Hearts as well as Spiral Castle, which I didn't feel was an equitable exchange. Needless to say, those became my first targets. I was also able to get some assistance from the Dwarves to take Myth Drannor in Fall 2 as well.

Year 3: I was starting to get requests from the Archers to fight the Gnomes, and vice versa. The Pirates were also wanting me to betray the Gnomes. I told the Pirates I would work with them, but really had no intention of doing so. The Pirates had far fewer armies than the Gnomes, so I figured with the Gnomes as a buffer between the Pirates and I, there was no way they could attack me if I stabbed them.

Also, this was around the time it became obvious that the Ogres/Leprechauns alliance (Leggers) was going to triumph in the south, so I started communicating with them about end game drawing and how many people would make the cut. They initially wanted a 3 way draw, but I figured we would need at least the Magicians and Gnomes to be a part of things.

This was about when the Magicians contacted me about allying to take care of the north, so it all meshed together well.

Years 5-7:The Knights wanted to work together to finish off the Barbarians. The Centaurs were offering to help me against the Knights, so once the Barbs were finished, it was only logical to take out the Knights afterwards. The Rogues were a bit passive, they were working a bit with the Magicians against the Trolls and Centaurs, but they weren't really expanding too much southwards.

8: The Year I had to stab the Dwarves. The Leggers were just killing my allies the Dwarves way too badly in the Underworld, and I didn't think I would be able to help him hold on to his above world provinces. Thus, I stabbed him in the Julianthes and Great Glacier. Sorry Dwarves, you really deserved better for your loyalty.

Mopping up Years 9, 10, 11: The Leggers were honest, and just kept their positions. They could have attacked northwards (there was quite a few times that they could have overwhelmed my defenses in Great Glacier, for instance), but they were decent enough to hold in place. There was almost a bit of a tiff over who would get Pan's Labyrinth, but the Leprechauns were OK w/ the Gnomes getting it.

The only aberration late game was that the Ogres were toying with the idea of coordinating a massive attack on the Leprechauns, just to show that we could take 8+ SC's from him in one fell swoop. I was very opposed to this idea, however, as I feel that people who are reliable allies should really be part of the draw if they have helped you all game.

... With that said, of course, I did stab my most loyal ally the Rogues before the game ended. I feel terrible for not campaigning to get the Rogues included in the draw. I mean, it would have only been ~10 pts less to have a 6th in the draw. But the Rogues low SC count meant he was the easiest one to dump overboard, so that was what happened. Rogues, you were a stalwart ally, and I wish you the best of luck in the future.

I look forward to seeing more EoG's. Thanks all for being involved!

Ogres EoG Part 2

Years 2-3

During these years, I decided for definate that my ally would be the Leprechauns. The Nomads were still on the run around the area, but I decided to go all out aggressive and attack the Samurai and the Elves at the same time. At this point, I first contacted the Dwarves, asking if I could move underground to Nowwhat, and he agreed, but then I spotted that I could get there quicker via Devil's Canyon, so I did.

At this point, the Faeries contacted me, congratulating me on my 3-build, so I replied with the same. The Faeries and I stayed equal on SCs until 3 or 4, I think, when I pulled ahead.

As I was gaining a large amount in the East, I decided to let the Leps have the Elf home SCs. However, this made it very hard to get fleets out, and we had to come to an agreement of me moving them out through Gelfing in a Spring move.

It was in 3 that I first started concentrating on the rest of the board, and I realised that the Leps and I were going to finish off the South well before anyone else stopped fighting. Since we had a large amount of armies and not many fleets, we agreed to go Underground. This didnt happen until 4, when we broke through into Hoarluk.

On a side note, Whoville was the longest neutral in the game. All the rest had gone by Fall 2 but Whoville stayed neutral until Fall 5. This was because I had agreed that the Leps could have it, but they had no armies left to go for it.

Anyhow, from 4-8 was the time of attacking the Dwarves, and they were the greatest adversary yet, not least because of their amazing defensive position around Nowwhat and their eternal fleet build spot. Their constant NMRs helped and hindered, usually with the Leps altering their orders and me not doing so, so nobody got anywhere. I was incredibly relieved when the Faeries stabbed them, I knew we could have taken them out easily at this point but the time it had taken so far was very frustrating; my original plan of using it as an attack route wouldn't work any more, as everyone was too developed.

So, for the first time, I turned to Diplomacy (this was in about 6). So far, the only people I had contacted to any degree were the Faeries and the Leps (and the Samurai, but they were gone by now). I suggested a four-way to the Faeries, asking them to help eliminate the Gnomes, the weakest of the five big powers - I never considered the Rogues a power due to their spread position - but the Faeries wouldn't go for it. When I contacted the Magicians about it I realised that they wouldn't do it because we were too powerful; they were scared of us attacking in a Juggernaught style, I think.

Around 9, I handed over to a sitter, who did just that. He sat. This was, more or less, what I told him to do, but I expected him to at least get some fleets out. Still, it made people trust us, but by the time I got back there wasn't much I could do.

I realised that there was no way I could convince anyone in the south to attack anyone else, so I contemplated attacking the Leps. I started thinking that if I could get the Faeries involved then we could take 12 SCs in one turn and cripple them. I actually had orders set to do this at one point, but the Faeries didn't seem happy about it, and I realised that I really didn't want them to die, which made stabbing them a bit pointless, as I was stalemated in the North and couldn't go for a solo.

Instead, I started shuffling fleets across the Wizard coast. This could have got me into the major seas (almost wholly controlled by the Faeries) but really it was a last ditch attempt at trying to convince one of the powers to turn on the Faeries. I reckoned if I made it seem like I was able to help cripple the Faeries they might go for it, but I realised I would never be in that position. I tried to justify my actions to the Faeries as 'in case they stabbed the magicians' so that I could justify attacking them without the whole board turning on me, but the opportunity never arose. The Rogues were finished off and the draw was declared.

So, great game everybody. Sorry for the incredibly long EoG. One thing I noticed in this game was the 'Vulture' attitude; once somebody was weak, everyone ganged up on them (this happend with the Trolls, then Pirates, then the Rogues). It was this that made you guys develop quickly enough to stop the OL Juggernaught. One question; was this directed (did you contact each other about it beforehand) or did you all just go for the same person because they were weak?

Reading your EoGs was also interesting; it's made me realise just how early our alliance was considered a major threat.

CaptainMeme, signing off. Phew, that was a lot of typing.

While the Vulture attitude was definitely present, it was more of a late arrival kind of thing.
IE: I started against the Trolls,then my Pirate Allies came to finish them. Then my ally Gnomes knocked down the Pirates, and I helped to finish them. These strikes were coordinated most of the time.

A bit late, but anyhow...
Leprechauns EoG:

So this was basically my second Haven game too, so based on what I saw on my last game, I had no choice but to either ally with the Elves against the Ogres or the other way around if I wanted to stay alive.

Year 1:
The Magicians were the first one to contact me, even though we had the undead putting a barrier between both of us. Thus, preventing any kind of ''war'' between both of us straight at the beginning. In any case, he offered peace, so why not? In any case, I wanted to take care of the Ogres or Elves alliance as soon as possible. I tried contacting the undead, but the were kinda slow.

So then I contacted both the Elves and the Ogres, the Elves never quit answered me, so I guess I opted for an alliance with the Ogre cause at least there were some communication between both of us. I was a bit doubtful of my alliance with the Ogre after having seen that there had been no agressive manoeuvers conducted by the Ogres against the Elves, but I also knew that I had the upper hand against the Elves.

During that time, I started arguing with the Undead and the conversation ended up as a conflict between both of our nations.

Year 2:
Defeated the Elves, the Ogres agreed to help me destroy them during autumn, I started to trust him a bit more. The undead problem was still a pain in the ass though. I managed to get Enchanted Island by taking advantage of the war between Samurais and Hobbits in the east, no one saw it coming. I kinda had an agreement of Non-Agression with the Samurai so I wasn't scared of him attacking, he was starting to lose all of his SCs anywais.

Year 3
Magicians helped we weaken the undead, thanks to that, I would not need to worry about the undead anymore. Back in the east, Samurai and Hobbits are getting weaker, Magicians and Ogres are getting bigger.

The Ogres built a fleet he sent into Three River Lake, but his only way out was by getting though my SCs (initially the Elves SCs)... I was forseeing a major stab there, kinda on guard, asking a lot of questions. Still chose to trust him since I wanted to take fully care of the Undead before initiating anything else.

Year 4
So the Ogres went through my SC, but did'nt stay there, so they didn't steal my SC... ouff what a relief. But what the hell? Why would he send it to NRL? There's nothing over there and it's far from the Ogre territory...? He says it's to help me, he wants a strong ally. Sounds cute and all, but still fishy, I'm trying to stay on guard but I still know (and that when on till the end of the game) that if the Ogres were to attack me, he would have the upper hand and I would end up being destroyed. As for the Undead, well it's more like scavenging, there's almost nothing left. I instaured a DMZ with the Magicians which was pretty clear, so no worries over there.

Year 5
The Undead are destroyed, the Ogres are getting more and more trustworthy and... I forgot to send my orders in spring... Funny thing is it didn't change anything, I had a DMZ with the Magicians and things were going well with the Ogres. This year we agreed to attack the Dwarves so plans of going to the underworld were underway and I had the plan to clean all of the Dwarves SCs on that little Island.

Years 6-7
Basically the same stuff, a lot of communication with the Ogres, plans for the conquest of the underworld, me trying to get his SCs on the Island and the Ogres and I taking advantage of the slowly dying Wizards to take his SCs. The dwarves never were a threat offensively, but damn they had a good defense!

The Ogres and I were starting to take about a possible three way. Since the Faeries were huge and pretty friendly we wanted to include them in it too. We though that after the dwarves, there would be a war between Pirates, Trolls and Magicians, weakening the three of them, and after an alliance with the Magicians, we could stab them and take control of the western part of the map. The Fearies would clean the Western + Northern part and Voila, we would had a three way.

Year 8-9
So the Dwarves are dead, let's go for the Trolls and Pirates, but things are getting complicated, especially for the ogres with their fleets... Things aren't as easy as we thought... Ogres are thinking about attacking the Faeries but that seems like something that would be way to difficult to achieve. We decide to clean off the weak nation, sit back and watch what will happen.

Year 10-11-12
So basically, the Fearies are with the Gnomes, the Magicians are with the Rogues and I am with the Ogres... This year we waited, hoping that shit would hit the fan between Gnomes and Magicians, getting thus the Rogues and Faeries involved. We would ally with the strongest, take what is left of the SCs, and perhaps finish this on a four way.
But nothing happened, I opted for a ''get rid of the weak and let's finish this'' it wasn't going anymore either.

I was groing more and more worried about the Ogres however, I know they could have just attacked me pretty easily and take a couple of SCs, but I kept trusting him, believing that Diplomacy ain't just about stabbing and that an alliance CAN work out for a full game.

Reading the EoG, I see that I wasn't wrong at all about groing worried about the Ogre's last stab. Nevertheless, it has been one of the strongest alliance I ever had.

Yeah, sorry about considering the last stab. This has probably been the strongest alliance I've ever had, too.
I'm not sure why I moved to NRL in 4; I'll have a look back through the maps and see if I can remember.

Didn't we agree on my move to NRL? I'm sure it was so that I could support you to Caer the turn after.

Yeah, like I said, it seemed too good to be true, I decided to trust but I was still strongly thinking that you were about to stab me.

You helped me to get Caer and Terabithia with that fleet, it was just the first time I saw someone offering his help like that... I mean it helped us build a stronger alliance, but on an ''egoistic'' point of view, that fleet didn't really helped you, it was like a free give away.

I didn't expect that much help, without having to strongly repay, that's mainly why I was kinda confused.

Well, I couldn't really do much else with the fleet, and it gained me something else - protection. If someone gets a fleet into TRL the Ogres are dead, so you getting as many territories north of that meant that you would fight to defend it, and I didn't need to :D
But it was mainly because I wanted my ally to be strong.