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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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nopunin10did (987 D)
Mon 12 AM UTC
(+1)
Replace PPSC with something rank-based?
I've put together a length proposal over on PlayDip to provide a rank-based scoring system for draws that's similar to the Carnage system used in several North American Dip tournaments today.

https://www.playdiplomacy.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=57975#p951166
63 replies
Open
gman314 (1016 D)
12 Mar 11 UTC
(+18)
Winning
Oli won.
On Imperial Civilization's off-topic thread (link inside), there was a brief stint of Second to Last Person to Post Wins. Now that the thread is closed, Oli won.
6704 replies
Open
Devonian (1871 D)
29 Jun 15 UTC
(+13)
1v1 Tournament Rules, Rankings, and Challenges
Official Rules for 1v1 Ladder Tournament
1572 replies
Open
The Ambassador (1626 D (B) (B))
Sun 10 AM UTC
(+1)
Padlock City
What's the deal with all the padlocks that have appeared throughout my games when viewed on the vDip homepage?
56 replies
Open
Notifications by email?
Is there a way I can get email notifications for my campaigns? I haven't gotten any at all, and because of that I've lost several games.
2 replies
Open
kaner406 (1559 D Mod (B) (B))
10 Mar 18 UTC
(+4)
Bourse 2018
See below:
191 replies
Open
The Ambassador (1626 D (B) (B))
27 Oct 17 UTC
1066 Tournament
As discussed in episode 23 of the Diplomacy Games podcast I'm thinking of putting together a 1066 tournament. Interested takers?
143 replies
Open
butterhead (975 D)
21 May 12 UTC
(+11)
Advertise your NON-live games here!
In an effort to compromise the pro-ads versus anti-ads for games: Post here for your non-live games to cut down on the number of ads but still advertise games. Post game link, WTA or PPSC, and the bet. Note: this doesn't count for special rules games.
2409 replies
Open
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
(+2)
At long last: 1900
With some help from Tobias & Oliver, my implementation of Baron VonPowell's "1900" is finally live.

nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
http://www.vdiplomacy.com/variants.php?variantID=1900

This is an established variant with established rules. They're not changing. However, I am looking for feedback on the following:

- Russia (olive) & Italy (emerald): on some screens these look very distinct to me, on others less so. Do you have trouble distinguishing them?
- I'm not currently happy with how the abbreviations look in the high-resolution version. Do you think it would help to remove the white outlines of text there?
- What bugs have you encountered?
- Are there any locations whose unit placements make the map harder to read?
- What other graphical issues have you encountered?

Note that the colors of the powers are something I worked with Baron on for this edition. No, I'm not going to swap yellow and red back again; there are flag/historical reasons for Austria-Hungary to be yellow and Turkey to be red.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Tue 12 Jun UTC
Once again, big thanks to Alex for bringing 1900 to vDip. If I find out any bugs I will report it.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Tue 12 Jun UTC
Suggestion: Bosnia should be colored neutral. The formal annexation of Bosnia only happened in 1908; in 1900 the region was under Austrian occupation but not under Austro-Hungarian sovereignty.

It formally belonged to the Ottoman Empire, and I think that making it neutral is the best course of action to represent its (at the time) ambiguous political status.

Some maps even make it (like Tripolitania & Cyrenaica) with a yellow/red outline (depends on Turkey's color), but I guess that would be too much work.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
In the PBEM version of this map, I actually do include red outlines for those regions:
https://i.imgur.com/Gd5ANFF.png

There wasn't a straightforward way to both include these and get them to disappear later. I wouldn't want those lines to stick around after a unit actual visits/captures those territories. In PBEM context, I can just manually get rid of them, as seen here:

https://i.imgur.com/TFoU1mj.png

I'll make a note though. Making Bosnia neutral in color might be a good compromise.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Tue 12 Jun UTC
I noticed Italy has Fleet Rome rather than Army Rome.

'1900: Sharp's Edition', now that's a variant I would play!
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
That is most definitely a bug. Good catch!
G-Man (2360 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
* Russia and Italy look very distinct on my screen
* I think the abbreviations are easier to read with the white outlines and look good
* No unit placements are affecting the reading of the map for me
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
Glad to hear. 1900 is a well crafted variant, which is not something I say lightly.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
@G-Man
Which resolution are you looking at?

For the low-res map (the default one), I find that the white outlined abbreviations help, but the high-res map, they seem to make a mess.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
@Enriador
Oli posted the fix, and there's an army in Rome (as intended).
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
The EMR rule seems unfair to the rest of the players.
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
As for graphics:
Mostly fine; however, some provinces such as Wales or Vienna are quite small. Perhaps make them bigger?
Nice work devs!
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
(+1)
variantID=1900
LOL
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
Sorry for too many posts, but two more things...
* Large map font outlines are ok, but the font is disparate with the small map.
* Why is '1900' not in white outline?
drano019 (2150 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
Not that I'm arguing the color, but I have to admit, I find the French description of their color quite funny.

"Teal Blue, the shade of blue used in the insignia of the French Air Force"

The French Air Force......in a map set in 1900...
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
P.S. Does Palestine ave two coasts?
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
*have*
G-Man (2360 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
Both the small and large maps nopunin10did.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
@Sky_Hopper
"The EMR rule seems unfair to the rest of the players."
- It might seem that way, but in practice, it keeps Russia from being (by far) the weakest of the powers. It was something Baron added to the rules after several iterations and playtests. With the rule in place, Russia is in the middle-chunk of the powers balance-wise.

"some provinces such as Wales or Vienna are quite small. Perhaps make them bigger?"
- This map represents the borders that Baron and I worked to represent. Historicity took preference over practicality in some cases; at small resolutions I imagine this can be a bit frustrating. Can you still see all the provinces that Vienna/Wales/etc. border? What could potentially be adjusted is the positioning of the units or names, if those are obscuring the borders.

"Large map font outlines are ok, but the font is disparate with the small map."
- It is a different font. For the small map, I went for a font that's more optimized for low resolutions. I wanted to use a variant of Caslon for the large map, since that was a common font from the era, but it may be harming readability.

"Why is '1900' not in white outline?"
- Mostly because it doesn't need it, but that admittedly does make it inconsistent... I'll think on this one.

"P.S. Does Palestine ave two coasts? "
- This one is addressed in the verbose rules; the micro-coast in the south is included for geographic accuracy only. Only the main coast of Palestine is actually playable.

nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
@drano019

Yes, that is anachronistic. Unfortunately, too many countries seem to use the same shades of blue and red in their flags...
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
"variantID=1900
LOL"

Damn straight.
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
@nopunin10did:
I suggest you just forgo the "south" coast of Palestine and just make things simpler.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
@Sky_Hopper:
I'll consider it. I'm hesitant to change much of the map's underlying geometry, since it was based on Baron's own official drawings, and that coast exists geographically if not for the game.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Wed 13 Jun UTC
@Enriador
Baron confirmed that, given the limitations for this iteration of the map, Bosnia should stay yellow, and Cyrenaica should instead be red.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Wed 13 Jun UTC
@nopunin10did

Oh. If Baron says Yellow Bosnia, then Yellow Bosnia it is.

But Red Cyrenaica?! It's just half of Ottoman Libya, and since TRP must be neutral, it will look incredibly inconsistent on-map with half the country divided. Best to leave CYR neutral as well, as the region was firmly connected to Tripolitania in every way.

I don't mind southern Palestine. It's clearly not a canal neither has a South Coast on-map, and given the way vDip deals with orders input the grand total of problems that will arise from this cosmetic coast is likely zero.

I find the smallmap font hard-ish to read as well, as I said elsewhere. Far from impossible, just slightly unclear at first sight.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Wed 13 Jun UTC
P.S.: Yellow Bosnia + Neutral CYR/BUL/ARA, the status quo, is actually very reasonable on second thought. The criteria for coloring can be seem as De Facto power over a region, not De Jure.

That way we justify why the Senussi emirate in Libya, the Bulgarian monarchy and the Arabian tribes are neutral, and why Bosnia is under Austrian control at start.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Wed 13 Jun UTC
@Sky_Hopper, why does the Russian Emergency Measures (REM) seem unfair?

I assume you didn't read the Gamer's Guide; the Guide perfectly explains the rationale behind it in great detail. Before this rule, Russia was by far the weakest of the Great Powers, worse than even Italy in Classic. Now Russia can kick some ass as they don't crumble so easily.

The only change to the variant I would like to see is a very small map change in Italy, with Tuscany being reborn and Rome annexing southern Venetia to gain an East Coast. This change was proposed by Baron Powell himself back in 2015, and the goal is to reduce the screaming Italo-French tension.

I recommend this article for those interested in variant design in general. The proposed change is at the bottom of the page: http://uk.diplom.org/pouch//Zine/S2015M/Powell/1900change.htm
nopunin10did (987 D)
Wed 13 Jun UTC
Tangent:

Note that I'm not going to make this (or any) change to the map's topology or rules, since I think perpetual material redesigns can hurt a variant's longevity, but the one small change I'd make is this:

I'd break the adjacency between Konya / Armenia and instead make Ankara & Damascus adjacent. I've found that SCs that are isolated, without being adjacent to any others, can potentially present defensive problems. It's particularly true when such an SC is on the mainland, unlike London or Tunis from classic Dip.

Turkey is currently the back-of-the-pack in terms of performance in 1900, and giving it a home SC that's so disconnected strikes me as a weakness in its case.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Wed 13 Jun UTC
>I'd break the adjacency between Konya / Armenia and instead make Ankara & Damascus adjacent.<

An interesting proposal; never saw it anywhere else. Does Baron have an opinion?

I like your rationale, as too often Damascus feels like a far away outpost like Algeria or Egypt rather than a decent third home center. Improving Turkey's defensibility shouldn't create a dangerous ripple effect on the rest of the board, I hope.

A similar situation is faced by France, with Marseilles being isolated and too often victim of an Italian attack (A MIL-SWI, A ROM-PIE). I believe, like Baron does, that adding Tuscany back would ease tensions between the two weakest powers of 1900.

Turkey is in the back of the pack indeed, but even more behind we have Italy & France, two powers practically doomed to conflict due to multiple zones of tension, especially in Piedmont/Switzerland. As you can see here (http://uk.diplom.org/pouch//Zine/F2014R/Powell/france2.htm) France is now dead last in overall performance with its two primary neighbors, Germany & Britain, sporting superior performances.

Can't we have both proposals, in the hopes of a better experience? *.*
nopunin10did (987 D)
Wed 13 Jun UTC
Anyway, 1900 really ought to just stay as it is at this point. Let it stand on its own merits.

I've seen a number of attempts to reinvent the European wheel by this point, trying to "fix" the original conceit of the board to make it more universally balanced. 1900 was one attempt to do so, and it didn't quite meet *that* goal. The data from full press games currently suggest that it's approximately as balanced / imbalanced as classic Dip, rather than a drastic improvement.

It does succeed in its other goals, though. It's more historically accurate to the period; the borders are more reflective of the political divisions, and the power imbalance matches the history too (Germany on top, Turkey on bottom).

1900 increases interaction between powers that normally lie on totally opposite sides of the map. It's more likely to end in a solo, partly because of its winning conditions and partly because it makes many of the classic stalemate lines harder (though not impossible) to form.

Instead of trying to perpetually improve upon it, what I would suggest is that variant developers look at these sorts of considerations when making *new* maps.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Wed 13 Jun UTC
Fair points @nopunin10did. 1900 isn't perfect but is already quite awesome on its own. I also believe that a variant shines better when free from the shackles of another.

Does it mean you will scrap the DAM-ANK idea?
nopunin10did (987 D)
Wed 13 Jun UTC
Sorry, I should be clear. I didn't mean to say I was actually going to connect Damascus to Ankara. I was meaning to state that, were Baron still planning to make further changes to 1900, I'd suggest that change.

He's not, and I'm cool with that. I think there's an initial phase where you should keep updating a variant based on playtest feedback, but at some point it should maintain its own identity. I imagine someone will iterate on 1900 in the future; you kind of already have in some ways, Enriador, with your 1913 (?) variant.

But I'd let 1900 stand unchanged, like a book that's been written.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Wed 13 Jun UTC
1913 takes a page from 1900's Africa, but I will likely scrap it in favor of Legacy of Versailles' Africa (passable Southern Algeria annoys me). Otherwise it has influences from Diplomacy II, Abstraction III and Milan.

Edwardian (Version 2) also started as a subvariant of 1900; you may recall it from the PlayDip forums.

Now that 1900 is set in stone here, can we dream that Alex "The Magician" Ronke will give us Diplomacy Points - and hence some of Baron's masterpieces like Ambition & Empire and College of Cardinals? =D
nopunin10did (987 D)
Thu 14 Jun UTC
Feel free to dream. This project took me far, far too long for what it was. DP variant support would require more than I’m willing to take on right now.

Maybe I’ll come back to vDip dev work in a year or two, but I have some other projects that are higher priority.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Thu 14 Jun UTC
A while ago I studied the several possible routes to victory available in 1900, and came up with some interesting information regarding how many supply centers can a power's freshly-built unit reach within four seasons/two years.

POWER: N° of SCs (Difference from Classic)

ITALY: 31 (+4)
FRANCE: 33 (+6)
BRITAIN: 23 (+4)
GERMANY: 31 (+1)
TURKEY: 23 (+5)
AUSTRIA-HUNGARY: 31 (+4)
RUSSIA: 31 (+2)

Amazingly enough, we got four powers tied in reach (Italy, Russia, Germany and Austria-Hungary), with the Wicked Witches (Britain and Turkey) also tied, and leading the isolated leader being France - 1900's weakest power!

I think these numbers are somewhat telling about how well balanced the base map is. I think I calculated the tempi required as well, if I find it I will post it here.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Thu 14 Jun UTC
France isn't 1900's weakest power, FYI. It's Turkey by far. France is either 5th or 6th, roughly tied with Russia, but nearly everyone other than Germany or Turkey is really close performance-wise.

I'll email you a spreadsheet that shows some "next steps" you can take with your tempi calculations.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Thu 14 Jun UTC
In a census of 304 full press games (email and web), with no additional variants like fog of war, if you score those games using old-school DSS (what you all call WTA), the overall percentages of points won by each power:

AH 13.2%
BR 14.1%
FR 12.8%
GE 21.1%
IT 15.2%
RU 13.1%
TU 10.2%

Honestly not bad balance-wise.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Thu 14 Jun UTC
According to Baron Powell, back in 2014 and considering 203 games, France *was* the weakest power. Source: http://uk.diplom.org/pouch//Zine/F2014R/Powell/france2.htm

Does PlayDip make these statistics freely available somewhere? Never saw them.

Your data puts Turkey as the weakest, France as the second weakest. Both powers suffer from having isolated home SCs (Marseilles & Damascus), as we discussed previously. Coincidence? =O

We can see how small the sample size (still) is. I hope automating 1900 to vDip (maybe webDip in the future; 1900 is quite proven already) will shine some extra light on how the powers truly perform.

Feel free to email me! I am quite intrigued.
nopunin10did (987 D)
Fri 15 Jun UTC
My data set included his 203 games, plus 101 more. I used a web-scraper and a lot of Excel trickery to get those results from PD. For a Dip variant, it's actually a halfway decent sample size. I wish vDip broke down its results to be able to filter by full press v. gunboat and so on...

France is second-weakest, but I wouldn't overstress that. The five countries in the middle are all huddled close to one another, particularly when you normalize those figures according to the standard deviation.

I agree that the isolated SCs hurt France, though I'm not sure I'd call Marseilles all that isolated. It's definitely disconnected from other home SCs, but it's part of a massive SC network.

Turkey and Germany are the distinctly different ones.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Fri 15 Jun UTC
The Sick Man & the Hegemon. I think it's very fitting!
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Sat 16 Jun UTC
@nopunin10did, will the variant have Interactive Map support?
nopunin10did (987 D)
Sat 16 Jun UTC
I’m not sure what is involved in that, but my understanding is that it requires the artwork to be much simpler in order to handle region detection (since there’s no polygon definitions for the spaces)
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
Sun 07 AM UTC
The interactive map requires a smallmap-file with the sea-territories colored in different colors too. It's named "IA_smallmap" and put in the directory "interactiveMap".

Basically that's it. If you want to adjust the icons for the interactive map or add additional orders you need to add some javascript. But the map is enough.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Sun 01 PM UTC
Feedback: Austria-Hungary's font color is blinding! Can we have a nicer shade of yellow? Like #A5A500 or #C48F00.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Sun 01 PM UTC
@Oli, @nopunin10did, would this IA_smallmap work?

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pjne1rkonobob0l/IA_smallmap.png?dl=0
nopunin10did (987 D)
Sun 05 PM UTC
@Enriador

Where does the font show up yellow? I can come up with a similar, darker shade for the given hue, but I'm not sure where you're seeing text come up that way.
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Sun 07 PM UTC
@nopunin10did

The font shows up in yellow whenever Austria-Hungary writes something.


47 replies
WWII Tournament
I would like to start a tournament. I've seen the Known World and 1v1 tournaments, and those are great fun. So why not apply it to World War II? I'm still working out the details, but I'll post some details.
304 replies
Open
Anon (?? D)
Sat 16 Jun UTC
Would anyone like to join a Known World game?
http://www.vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=35213
0 replies
Open
Frozen Dog (1000 D)
Thu 14 Jun UTC
Playtest of variant
Hi! I am trying to organize a playtest of a variant I created with some unique rules that made it not possible to implement on vdiplomacy (yet!). I have called it 'Feudal Diplomacy'. [See below for details!]
3 replies
Open
ubercacher16 (1271 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
Possible Change
See first post
10 replies
Open
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
Tue 12 Jun UTC
(+1)
Game Showcase
Here, feel free to share any links to games that are notable to you!
10 replies
Open
CCR (1717 D)
Wed 13 Jun UTC
Zero games variants
I thought I'd create a few games of the newest variants, and looked for those still not played, without opened games, or no new ones yet.
2 replies
Open
Mittag (1582 D)
Sat 09 Jun UTC
Sandboxes?
Does anyone know any good adjudicator, online of for Mac, that I could use for playing around with positions?
7 replies
Open
Caerus (1488 D)
Mon 04 Jun UTC
Clock Watching - Sniping the NMRs
I am unaware of the actual term, but is it considered bad form here on vDip to change your orders in anticipation of an opponent's upcoming NMR?
36 replies
Open
Ghastly (986 D)
Thu 07 Jun UTC
Would appreciate a replacement for 1800 variant Prussia
I have no motivation to keep playing turns, so I figure I could give my only game to someone who does. Sorry for making a new thread, I couldn't find the game-sitters thread.
2 replies
Open
Enriador (1396 D (B))
Sun 03 Jun UTC
(+1)
[New Variant] Scramble
Play as an European colonial power during the Scramble for Africa! Based on @Tristan's 'Africa' variant.

Soon on vDip: http://vdiplomacy.com/variants.php?variantID=124
13 replies
Open
Skyrock (1157 D)
Sun 03 Jun UTC
Thoughts on fixing the Classic - Economic variant
See main post below.
14 replies
Open
nopunin10did (987 D)
30 May 17 UTC
(+1)
1900 for vDip: Progress Report (ongoing)
As mentioned in another thread, I've been working on the code and assets necessary to port Baron M. Powell's variant 1900 to vDip and/or webDip.

In order to keep myself accountable in some fashion to actually complete this task, and not just talk about it, I've created a small project plan where I can mark my progress.
88 replies
Open
Sky_Hopper (936 D)
01 Jun 18 UTC
[Variant] Nautical
The Classic map, but with bigger sea territories!

16 replies
Open
Enriador (1396 D (B))
28 May 18 UTC
(+1)
Taking over Civil Disorders should be free of charge
Reasoning: the player who takes over a Civil Disorder is not just putting themself in a precarious position (as they must evaluate everybody's styles and strategies) but they are also saving the game's balance and fun.

In order to reward/incentive people to take more CDs, I believe that making it free of charge (rather than current 50% discount) would be for the best. Thoughts?
62 replies
Open
The Ambassador (1626 D (B) (B))
02 Sep 16 UTC
(+7)
New podcast for online Dip games
Hi everyone

Kaner and I have started a podcast about playing Diplomacy online....
177 replies
Open
d-ice (1892 D)
16 May 18 UTC
(+5)
Variants as maps, rules and tweaks
I’d like to propose a variant system that could lead to a significant increase in flexibility of testing out new variants.
12 replies
Open
Imp. Dipl.: urgent replacement for Prussia required
For following game as Prussia:
http://vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=34905#gamePanel
Post your user ID/send it
3 replies
Open
Enriador (1396 D (B))
25 Apr 18 UTC
(+2)
New Variant: Crusades 1201
Hail diplomats,

New 11-players variant coming up, set in the High Middle Ages.
24 replies
Open
00matthew2000 (2531 D)
29 May 18 UTC
New Imperial Diplomacy Game, Players Wanted
http://www.vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=35028
0 replies
Open
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
24 Jan 18 UTC
(+2)
New Variant: Dawn of the Enlightenment
It is on a temporary homepage, http://davidecohen.wixsite.com/diplomiscellany, since I am having a bit of trouble editing my main website. Please take a look. I would love to get comments, suggestions and criticism.
40 replies
Open
Known World Tournament
Awhile back, kaner proposed a Known World gunboat tournament in which 15 participants would play 15 games, one with each nation. I searched back for the thread, then just decided to start a new one. I want to see if there would be sufficient interest in this to try to get it off the ground.
461 replies
Open
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