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GOD (1850 D Mod (B))
12 May 23 UTC
Cleaning up gmaes lost in pause
About hald of our active games are currently paused. For oversight, I will start drawing games having been pause for more than half a year. If for whatever reason you are in such a game and would not like to have it paused, please write so in the mod forum.
7 replies
Open
Argyle Poblano (1931 D)
09 May 23 UTC
Any Toki Pona speakers?
Just wondering if there's any crossover between the Toki Pona community and vdip :)

(toki pona is a conlang for those confused)
3 replies
Open
Avocado (1434 D)
08 May 23 UTC
New Divided States Map
I felt like making a Divided States map which I named “Well, rip us” (for obvious reasons). If anyone who is reading this hasn’t joined, they should as this could be really fun.
https://www.vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=56122
0 replies
Open
kendall (1719 D)
04 May 23 UTC
Etiquette of readying your moves
I’ve notice that a lot of people stop readying their moves—even retreats—when the game isn’t going their way any more. Is there a strategic explanation for this or is just to pout?
16 replies
Open
GOD (1850 D Mod (B))
30 Apr 23 UTC
(+1)
Throwing the game
Since messages from people complaining about this have reached us quite a lot in the last weeks:
16 replies
Open
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
26 Apr 23 UTC
(+2)
New Rulebook Edition
The new Renegade edition of the rules is now available at https://renegadegamestudios.com/diplomacy/
Flame (1073 D)
28 Apr 23 UTC
What are the changes except the design of the book?
I have not yet done a line by line comparison (probably this weekend), but two noteworthy changes are:

1. Further confirmation that impossible order=hold order, and

2. A clear mechanic for civil disorder removals.
Enriador (1507 D)
28 Apr 23 UTC
The biggest change I spot is that timed play (either by a set end-date or by a fixed amount of real time) is now acknowledged as official victory criteria, alongside regular victories (18 SCs) and draws (agreement by survivors).

FtF and online play has extensively used timed play for decades, nice to finally see it recognized even if it changes little.
Mittag (1396 D)
29 Apr 23 UTC
Isn't "Dislodged by An Adjacent Convoy Attack" new as well? That's a clarification, at least. If I remember correctly, there are online platforms that don't follow this rule.

Also noteworthy that "Land and Convoy Routes" was not changed. That rule remains ambiguous.
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
30 Apr 23 UTC
(+1)
I have performed a comparative analysis of the Renegade's 6th Edition (2023) rule book and the previous 5th edition (2008) rule book. Disregarding cosmetic and non-substantive changes (such as changing the colors of the example maps or dropping a reference the CD-Rom version of the game), there are a handful of substantive changes, as follows:

1. The rule book has added, to the traditional outcomes of solo and DIAS, possible results for time-limited or turn-limited games.

"A game of Diplomacy can end in one of four ways:

1. Control 18 Supply Centers: As soon as one Great Power controls 18 supply centers, it’s considered to have gained control of Europe.
2. Draw Involving All Survivors: All players who still have supply centers agree to share equally in a draw.
3. Turn Limit: Game ends after a number of predetermined turns (e.g., after Fall 1907) and the winner is the player with the most centers. Tied players share in victory.
4. Time Limit: Game ends after a predetermined number of hours (e.g., 4 hours, 8 hours) and the winner is the player with the most centers. Tied players share in victory."

Leaving aside the question of whether a victory can be shared, this change does not really have a practical impact for other than "friendly" FTF games. Unless you are in a tournament, on line or otherwise, games are very rarely either time-limited or turn-limited. If you are in a tournament, those outcomes are too simplistic and will be superseded by the tournament scoring system.


2. Rather than a vague statement that units "farthest from the country are removed first", there is now a clear methodology:

"In the event of a power going into civil disorder or when a power does not order a required removal, (a) No unit on a supply center is to be removed unless there are no viable options and (b) Unit precedence for removal starts with furthest from an owned supply center, by counting absolute adjacent provinces regardless of the ability of the unit to move into it, are removed first. Fleets are removed before armies, and then units are removed in alphabetic order of the name of the province on the map."

Perhaps not the most elegantly written the rule, but certainly serviceable and a since it is unambiguous, a big improvement over the previous rule. Most, if not all platforms will need to revise their code to comply with this rule.


3. The previous rule book clarification about impossible orders being hold orders if further, unequivocally clarified with capital letters, no less):

"A unit given an impossible order results in the unit HOLDING so it can be supported in place. For example, “A Burgundy—Moon” or “A Bohemia—Edinburgh” are impossible moves."

At least one platform is not compliant with this rule.


4. The next change is a clarification (and tightening up) of "matching" in support order for units with multiple coasts, so that a player may now specify support to a particular coast:

"The specification of Support to a specific coast in a split province such as Spain must match the move of the piece ordered to that province. For instance:

France: F Portugal S F Mid-Atlantic - Spain (sc); F Mid-Atlantic - Spain (nc)

The movement is valid but the support order is invalid because it identified an incorrect coast. If the order was F Mid-Atlantic - Spain (sc), then the support order would be valid."

The concept of "matching" was undefined in previous editions of the rule book, and while I can understand the opinion of those that wanted matching to be limited to a province, rather than a coast, I feel that this clarification aligns more with the overall spirit of the rule. I believe multiple platforms are not compliant with the rule.


5. The last change relates to a conflict between two rules in previous editions, with one rule forbidding a retreat by a unit to "the province from which its attacker came" and the rule which permits two units to switch places if one or both are convoyed, the issue coming up when a convoy from an adjacent province succeeds and dislodges a unit. The new edition resolves the conflict:

"A dislodged unit can retreat to the position of the attacker when there is a convoy to an adjacent province. For example:

England: A Edi-Yor; F Nth C A Edi-Yor; A Lon S A Edi-Yor
Germany: A Yor H

The German army is dislodged from Yorkshire. If the army in Edinburgh had attacked via land to Yorkshire, then the German army could not retreat to Edinburgh. Since the attack is coming from the convoy in the North Sea, the army in Yorkshire can legally retreat to Edinburgh."

I have always been of the opinion that if a unit could have moved to a province successfully in the movement phase, the unit could be legally ordered to retreat to that province in the subsequent retreat phase. I think there are multiple platforms which are not compliant with this rule.
JECE (1534 D)
30 Apr 23 UTC
Comparing with Stabbeurfou's errata for the 2000 rules, it seems like the first two issues remain uncorrected:
https://web.archive.org/web/20191228034627/http://www.stabbeurfou.org/docs/regles/en/Compl_Hasbro_en.html

The civil disorder rule is quite different in that it seems to prioritize keeping units in any supply center, not just home supply centers.
Oh yes, there are still unresolved issues. But this does takes care of 3 or 4 previously outstanding items. Incremental progress, I guess, but I will take it.
RUFFHAUS 8 (2490 D)
01 May 23 UTC
(+1)
JECE: "The civil disorder rule is quite different in that it seems to prioritize keeping units in any supply center, not just home supply centers."

Agreed. An odd change really since there's no real need to extend the existence of a civil disorder position, and it could potential create scenarios that unjustly punish a prior ally or disaffected nation. This was never really a problem in past until folks started getting semantic to gain an unjust benefit. A few clarifying words could easily removed the perceived ambiguity. While it's not a completely disruptive change, it's really change for the sake of change. I think that the home supply center rule was more realistic and playable.

Another such change for the sake of change was the impossible order decision. While it's easy enough to adapt to, there's no real reason to do this. There is a valid order to hold and always has been. If players want to send subliminal messages with impossible orders, or actually make mistakes, the units ordered to move should be assumed to be ordered to mobilize and depart the zone, not to be entrench, receiving support. I'm curious why anyone thought that this needed to be changed.

The coastal support change is really somewhat deconstructive the the entire combat resolution philosophy. It's another example of where the prior rule functioned for all but those looking for a semantic excuse to gain an undeserved edge. This change, while needless is somewhat more tolerable since it places an emphasis on accuracy of order writing. And it definitely will stir up more drama in the manner of honest mistakes and "mistakes."
GOD (1850 D Mod (B))
01 May 23 UTC
Would you enlighten me on the nature of the „Renegade edition of the rules“? Never heard of them before.
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
01 May 23 UTC
(+1)
Renegade Game Studios is a small, independent game company. They obtained the publishing rights to Dip along with some other games. Acquire and Axis & Allies at least, there may be others, from Hasbro. I understand that the new edition will be generally available beginning this summer.
GOD (1850 D Mod (B))
01 May 23 UTC
Thank you.

I like the way they gave a modern overhaul to the map, looks good.
JECE (1534 D)
02 May 23 UTC
RUFFHAUS 8: "Another such change for the sake of change was the impossible order decision. While it's easy enough to adapt to, there's no real reason to do this. There is a valid order to hold and always has been. If players want to send subliminal messages with impossible orders, or actually make mistakes, the units ordered to move should be assumed to be ordered to mobilize and depart the zone, not to be entrench, receiving support. I'm curious why anyone thought that this needed to be changed."

The rationale has been thought through at length:

http://web.inter.nl.net/users/L.B.Kruijswijk/#4.E.1
JECE (1534 D)
02 May 23 UTC
(+1)
GOD: I agree that the map looks nice, but I wonder about some of the choices. The borders of Serbia, Greece and Albania are way off. I don't think that they did that for readability purposes, since, for example, if you look at Russia, Ukraine is now very tiny and you can hardly tell that Livonia borders Warsaw.
JECE (1534 D)
02 May 23 UTC
It's super-odd to make Ukraine so tiny given the ongoing war, to be honest . . .
Mittag (1396 D)
03 May 23 UTC
(+2)
They colored the islands. That's also a mistake. With Corsica being colored the same as Marseilles, the logical conclusion is that corsica belongs to Marseilles. And the logical conclusion from that, is that Marseilles borders Tyrrhenian.

Same issue with coloring Crete and Sardinia.

If you know, then you know, of course. But people that buy the game and has never played before, they don't know. And there's just no reason to include ambiguities like that.
Enriador (1507 D)
03 May 23 UTC
(+1)
My first Diplomacy board was a bootleg version that had colored islands. It took us 5 minutes to figure out that contiguous provinces without a name written on it are as impassable as Switzerland.

We have over a hundred variants with colored islands and enclaves, confusion over adjacency seems pretty low.
Mittag (1396 D)
03 May 23 UTC
I think the UI on vDip removes the risk of confusion. And you have the adjacency maps available for each variant as well. Anyway. Isn't the saying, what can be misunderstood will be misunderstood? Just seems unnecessary to me, especially since there's no in-game upside to coloring islands.
Enriador (1507 D)
03 May 23 UTC
Fair enough, maybe they could have kept their design vision but avoided any potential issues by tweaking the sea borders slightly (so e.g. Corsica was entirely covered by Gulf of Lyon).
GOD (1850 D Mod (B))
04 May 23 UTC
Personally, the lack of colouring for Sardinia has bothered me from an aesthetic POV for the last ten years or so, I like it.


19 replies
Chinese 2020-2021 Diplomacy League is so exciting!
The Chinese Diplomacy League games have been in "New games" for two years..? -_-
Unless I'm missing something about the Chinese way of playing Diplomacy, maybe it could be a good thing to delete these games? :)
4 replies
Open
finnrobertson15 (1000 D)
17 Apr 23 UTC
(+1)
Two New Variants: Classic - Arabia & 1939 (My first two)
My first two variants. Let me know what you think, and how I can improve either one or variant creation in general :)

https://imgur.com/a/sNNzxOC
29 replies
Open
David Hood (976 D)
26 Apr 23 UTC
April 2023 Deadline News is out, from the Diplomacy Broadcast Network
New Deadline episode released - Dipcon/Dixiecon memories, David E. Cohen interview, and headlines from around the world of Diplomacy: https://youtu.be/czJc_hG_zsg
0 replies
Open
Flame (1073 D)
19 Feb 23 UTC
Minor power variant dev-team
Who is willing or capable to join to make a new variant called "Minor power"?
26 replies
Open
Airplane units
Several years ago, I played a Dip game that I could not fully recall. Not the people I played with, the power I played as, or the exact changes to the rules. All I could remember is that the map played on involved countries all over the globe; that, alongside armies and fleets, it featured aerial units (and even nukes)
6 replies
Open
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
16 Apr 23 UTC
New Variant, Comments Wanted: Flowery War
This is a 5 player variant set in pre-Aztec Mesoamerica. I do not believe any previous variant has tackled this subject matter. Rules and abbreviations are on the map. One notable rule is a unit conversion/transformation option.
17 replies
Open
The Ambassador (1948 D (B))
11 Apr 23 UTC
Podcast listeners game
Hi folks

In the last podcast episode of Diplomacy Games, Kaner and I talked about having a Nine-Dash Line game with listeners.
8 replies
Open
The Desert Fox (1995 D)
26 Feb 23 UTC
Spring Training
Hey all, just wondering if we have any baseball fans here and if so what are your thoughts as your team starts playing games. I'm a die hard Minnesota Twins fan and am eager to get the season underway. The off season was filled with big money moves and I guess we'll see if those will pay off for the teams that went " all in " and spent.
7 replies
Open
David Hood (976 D)
17 Apr 23 UTC
Dipcon/Dixiecon coming up in May - FTF Variant Event
The 52nd annual North American Diplomacy Championship is coming up the last weekend in May. Remember we are also running a face to face variant event this year, using Ancient Med. More details at www.dixiecon.com.

0 replies
Open
Lord Saviour (1407 D)
23 Mar 23 UTC
(+1)
What is going on?!
Is anyone else going a bit mad looking at the state of the world? France on the verge of another revolution et cetera.
55 replies
Open
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
30 Mar 23 UTC
(+1)
New Variant: Twilight of the Classical World: Comments Wanted
This eight-player variant is set in an uncommon era, between the fall of Rome and the rise of Islam, toward the end of that period, in 609, during the Heraclian revolt against Emperor Phocas. I welcome comments or criticism. Variant rules are on the map. Check out the variant at https://davidecohen.wixsite.com/diplomiscellany/twilight-of-the-classical-world
11 replies
Open
Live game
Anyone interested in a live 1v1 match today?
1 reply
Open
MagicalSand (1726 D)
12 Mar 23 UTC
Has anyone ever played diplomacy in school?
I know I myself was ever able to, but some relatives did when they were in school. But perhaps some of the older players here played diplomacy in their history classes. I'm curious if anyone here has and if they have any cool stories to go with it? And maybe it's still used as a learning tool today yet even.
8 replies
Open
ubercacher16 (2169 D)
29 Mar 23 UTC
Extended Turns
Is there a way to see how many turns you have caused to extend?
2 replies
Open
gopher27 (1606 D Mod)
11 Mar 23 UTC
(+2)
Manifesto posting thread
"I guess the benefit of having the thread system and no forum here is that no one will bother to use it for their manifestos :P" ---Fake Al

Hear me, weirdos, malcontents and conspiracy theorists of vDip, your failure to post rambling disjointed manifestos has been noticed and commented upon.
33 replies
Open
MagicalSand (1726 D)
01 Mar 23 UTC
How do excused NMRs work?
So on a game I was playing in, it says something around the lines of "1 excused NMR / regain after 5 turn(s) / extend the first 1 turn(s)". So it leads me to believe that you get an excused NMR back after 5 turns, and wouldn't go into civil disorder.
10 replies
Open
AJManso4 (2318 D)
15 Mar 23 UTC
Would it make sense that playing diplomacy is actually a healthy exercise for your brain?
-
16 replies
Open
kestasjk (0 D)
13 Oct 22 UTC
(+3)
webDip merge
Hey all, kestasjk from webDiplomacy.net here.

I have a feeling this is going to get shot down straight away but that's totally fine; just want to lay out a long-term proposal for merging the code bases and see whether it's worth thinking about or if I'm barking up the wrong tree.
114 replies
Open
anqilan456 (1000 D X)
22 Mar 23 UTC
NBA 2K23 players have noticed that Herschel
NBA 2K23 players have noticed that Herschel "Dr. Disrespect' Beahm has made an appearance as a surprise player in the game.Along with the other major 2022 game launches, NBA 2K23 is set to begin play on September 9 and despite not being out in the moment, fans have already seen the 2x champion in the game.If you want to learn more about NBA 2K23 MT, please visit https://www.nba2king.com/Nba-2k23-Mt.html
0 replies
Open
anqilan456 (1000 D X)
22 Mar 23 UTC
Position within the Diablo 4's five classes


What they won't see is a wide variety of bodies, at least for each class. The Barbarian is strong and muscular for their position within the Diablo 4's five classes. The Sorcerer/Sorceress class looks strong enough to be able to lift books and wands, but they're not nearly as lean and athletic-looking like the Rogue.
If you want to learn more about Diablo 4 Gold,piease vist https://www.mmoexp.com/Diablo-4/Gold.html
0 replies
Open
anqilan456 (1000 D X)
22 Mar 23 UTC
The art of scoring from a corner fut 23
The left stick is used to steer the ball. The right stick is used to increase the level. To score from corners, it's preferred to strike the corner in-swinging, using the correct mix of precision and power.
If you want to learn more about FIFA 23 Coins,please vist mmoexp
0 replies
Open
Flame (1073 D)
20 Mar 23 UTC
Discord server for russian-speaking Diplomacy players
We start the Discord server for russian-speaking Diplomacy players here.
Join to get new friend and foes! ;)
1 reply
Open
Lord Saviour (1407 D)
15 Mar 23 UTC
Game limit?
I am in 3 games and cannot join any others because of game limits. Can someone help me please?
10 replies
Open
jason4747 (1633 D)
19 Mar 23 UTC
For Europa Renovatio players
I like how the colors are mostly reflected in the vDip game. Clearly related. Anyone know the backstory?

https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/11umkgx/map_of_europe_1500/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
2 replies
Open
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