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A place to discuss topics/games with other webDiplomacy players.
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00matthew2000 (2465 D)
29 May 18 UTC
New Imperial Diplomacy Game, Players Wanted
http://www.vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=35028
0 replies
Open
David E. Cohen (1000 D)
24 Jan 18 UTC
(+2)
New Variant: Dawn of the Enlightenment
It is on a temporary homepage, http://davidecohen.wixsite.com/diplomiscellany, since I am having a bit of trouble editing my main website. Please take a look. I would love to get comments, suggestions and criticism.
40 replies
Open
Sky_Hopper (829 D)
26 May 18 UTC
(+3)
A suggested change
It would be nice if eliminated players would be displayed in the order they were eliminated in, not alphabetically.
3 replies
Open
Flame (1058 D (B))
09 Jan 18 UTC
Western Known World 901
Please join the testgame
http://lab.diplomail.ru/board.php?gameID=67
5 replies
Open
Argentinean Empire (1294 D)
17 Jan 18 UTC
(+4)
Cold War Tournament
I am looking to start a rated Cold War tournament consisting of group and knockout stages. Groups of 4 will face each other twice, once as each country. The top two (or three, pending interest) from each group will move on to the knockout stage, with each matchup lasting two games. Users will play as each country once. If tied 1-1, an additional two games are played until a winner is determined.
147 replies
Open
vixol (1297 D)
26 May 18 UTC
CountrySwitch
Hi, if I use countryswitch in a non anonymous game, will the temporary players ID be visible instead of mine? The question in another way: will the other players see that the owner is temporarily another player?
1 reply
Open
Enriador (1451 D (B))
05 Mar 18 UTC
(+1)
Soon on vDiplomacy: Canton Diplomacy
After trying three excruciatingly long games of Colonial Diplomacy and seeing its annoying lack of balance by myself, I decided to revive Paul Webb's 'Canton Diplomacy' from the depths of the internet. With Oli's help and blessing we'll be playing it quite soon!

http://www.dipwiki.com/index.php?title=Canton
39 replies
Open
Enriador (1451 D (B))
24 May 18 UTC
[New Variant] Legacy of Versailles
Here's a new variant I have been cooking up for some time. It's set in 1939, right before war blows in Europe once again

http://vdiplomacy.com/variants.php?variantID=111
9 replies
Open
Enriador (1451 D (B))
28 Apr 18 UTC
(+2)
New Variant: Spice Islands
David Cohen's 'Spice Islands' will be coming to vDip! Here's a preview of the variant: http://vdiplomacy.com/variants.php?variantID=116

Available soonTM.
19 replies
Open
The Modern UN Tournament
Information below
19 replies
Open
pancake (981 D)
18 May 18 UTC
east asia map!!!
i think that should exist with a small advantage to china but a unified korea an an i india to balance that up.
6 replies
Open
GetDoneSon (992 D)
16 May 18 UTC
(+2)
Feature Request: Friends List
Similar to how the site already has functionality for muting and blocking other players, we should be able to add them to a friends list so that tracking them down to send PMs is more convenient. It would also make hosting games with players you know you enjoy playing with much easier. I don’t believe that this feature is currently in the issue tracker, and it seems like it would be very easy to implement given the current muting and blocking features already in place.
6 replies
Open
Enriador (1451 D (B))
10 Apr 18 UTC
(+5)
New Variant: 'Napoleonic: Empires & Coalitions'
Oli has locked me in his basement and only gives me food when I port a new variant. Send help.
14 replies
Open
Enriador (1451 D (B))
12 May 18 UTC
[New Variant] Caucasus
I was contacted by user @vixol a few weeks ago, who showed me his awesome variant set in post-Soviet Caucasus. I hope you guys like it!

Preview: http://vdiplomacy.com/variants.php?variantID=118
9 replies
Open
Enriador (1451 D (B))
07 Apr 18 UTC
(+2)
New Variant: Manifest Destiny III
Hail diplomats,

Yet another variant is coming: Manifest Destiny III. It's set in North America during the conquest of the Wild West.
35 replies
Open
Dr. Recommended (1719 D Mod (B))
24 Dec 16 UTC
(+2)
Variant Tournaments
I've really enjoyed playing variant-specific tournaments such as the Known World 15x15 currently underway.
700 replies
Open
Enriador (1451 D (B))
10 May 18 UTC
[Variant] Florence Diplomacy
What happens when you move two little dots around?
5 replies
Open
kaner406 (1430 D Mod (B) (B))
07 May 18 UTC
(+5)
Server not processing games.
I've gone ahead and added 24 hours to all games, to avoid any problems preemptively.
5 replies
Open
GOD (1711 D Mod (B))
16 Apr 18 UTC
(+1)
GODMODE
Hello everyone, If like to host a special rules game, if we could find enough players interested:
21 replies
Open
fasces349 (1053 D)
26 Dec 10 UTC
(+16)
Advertise live games here
Like in webdiplo, this thread will be used to help people find live games
3618 replies
Open
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
29 Apr 18 UTC
Help needed: Our 4 press-types.
Hi everybody.
I'm working on a rules-page about our 4 press-types.
Someone willing to submit some guide what these different press-types are, and what these mean for playing the game?
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
29 Apr 18 UTC
For example it's easy to grasp that a gunboat hat no chat-interface. But there is a lot to say about reading orders on the map and how this changes the whole tactic of the game.
Mercy (2043 D)
29 Apr 18 UTC
(+1)
I typed out something. I hope this is about the format that you want, or do you maybe want a more detailed explanation?


FULL PRESS

Full Press is the standard type of press. In Full Press games, all players can send each other private messages. In this game mode, you can never be sure what the other players are saying to each other and what kind of secret plans are being made. Full Press is the pinnacle of plotting and intrigue. Try to work out your plans with a select number of other players and try to not be surprised by unexpected alliances that might be forming against you.


PUBLIC PRESS

No private messages can be send in this game mode. The only type of messages that are possible are so-called global messages, which are messages that every player can see. No secret plans can be made, as every player can read everything that all the others are saying. Public Press games will involve large discussions that every player can take part in. Try to sway public opinion in your favor and persuade other players to work with you without antagonizing too many others.


GUNBOAT

Gunboat is the game mode in which no messages are allowed at all. This does not mean that it is impossible to form alliances, though; it just means that alliances have to be formed without the use of words. Players can signal that they have friendly intentions towards someone by simply not attacking or even by trying to support units of other players. Try to pay close attention to the map to see what the other players are up to and try to unravel their intentions. At the same time, keep in mind what other players will think of you when they observe your moves. Note that failed support orders are only visible on the large map, so you may want to look at that.


RULEBOOK PRESS

Rulebook Press is Full Press with a twist: You can send private messages to all players, except during retreat and build phases, where no messaging is possible! According to the rulebook of the board game of Diplomacy, there are no negotiation phases during builds and retreats, either; hence why this game mode is called Rulebook Press.
There is one grammatical error "can be send" should be "can be sent" but otherwise this is quite good and covers all the basics.
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
29 Apr 18 UTC
That's really good.
Thanks a lot. I will format this as a vDip-page and release it, so others can make additions/suggestion.
Skyrock (1123 D)
29 Apr 18 UTC
(+1)
Re: Gunboat:

[quote]Try to pay close attention to the map[/quote]

I would append this with "Try to pay close attention to the map [b]and the orders[/b]", as not all orders are shown on the map, especially the small map.

Other then that looks good.
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
29 Apr 18 UTC
Link: http://www.vdiplomacy.com/press.php
PS: I would like to add some generic info-text at the beginning. Any ideas?
baky123 (1198 D)
29 Apr 18 UTC
The game of Diplomacy offers much in the way of variants. While some of these are more simple map variants or more complex rule variations, there exist several different communication systems available to try which are outlined below.
ubercacher16 (1491 D)
30 Apr 18 UTC
In the gunboat section I would add something about the orders tab at the bottom of every game page.
Mercy (2043 D)
30 Apr 18 UTC
(+1)
@Oli: Thanks!
@Others: I think those are good improvements to the text.

Maybe google docs would help to work on texts like these?

For the generic text, I would just write: ''Diplomacy games can have many different settings and one of them regards the press type. Below we outline the different press types that are available on this server."

It is indeed an idea to write about the orders tab in the gunboat section. Maybe we want to write something about the tabs at the bottom of every page somewhere else anyway, though. Information about these is not yet available.

Also, now that we are adding and changing information of the site anyway, can I say that I think that the page about points (http://www.vdiplomacy.com/points.php) could use some improvements? Things that, in my opinion, ought to be changed, are:
* PPSC is presented as the default scoring system and WTA is presented later on as some alternative option. Either this should be reversed or WTA should be treated on equal footing with PPSC here. (An alternative option is to remove PPSC from the site altogether, but that is another discussion. :p)
* According to the page, points are used to separate experienced players from 'novices', since the former can afford to play in high stakes games and the latter can't. In practice, though, this almost never happens.
* The page recommends us to bet fewer points on WTA games than on PPSC games, since you are more likely to lose all in a WTA game. Apart from the fact that I find such a specific recommendation weird, I even doubt some of its validity, as WTA games are drawn far more often than PPSC games.
* The page says that it is about points, but it is actually only about dPoints. We also have vPoints now.

On this page, the text about draws very briefly touches on the concept of stalemate lines. Could it be an idea to write somewhere else something more about stalemate lines? It is an implicit rule that you can use stalemate lines to force a draw, so it could be nice to have some information on it on the site.

As a final note, the texts at the top of almost all screens say 'webDiplomacy' instead of 'vDiplomacy'. The link to the points page is even called 'webDiplomacy points'.
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
30 Apr 18 UTC
(+1)
For beginners (< 20 ohases played) there is a reminder below each map to check the largemap for failed orders.

My next "larger" project is getting rid of Dpoints completely and replace them with a "weight" for a game.
In the bet-field you can enter a %, and the vPoints adjust. So you could enter 0,5 (or 50% to make the game award half the usual vDpoints. Or 2 (200%) for double the weight.
But this is another topic and needs more considerations (as the weight of larger games, esp. in WTA needs some adjustment too)...
We just don't need to take care of the "Points"-rulepage that much at the moment as this will change "soon".
G-Man (2290 D)
30 Apr 18 UTC
Is there any chance we can add:

* The ability to send press to multiple countries -- but not all countries -- at one time? An example for Classic would be sending press to only Germany, Austria, and Italy
* The ability to have games that allow unidentified press (or what used to be called "Grey Press" at the Diplomatic Pouch) along with Public Press

These features would really add a lot.
Enriador (1451 D (B))
30 Apr 18 UTC
>The ability to send press to multiple countries -- but not all countries -- at one time? An example for Classic would be sending press to only Germany, Austria, and Italy

Not sure I like that. More in line with both FtF and PBEM, but I kinda like how things are now - weakens triple alliances and greatly adds to intrigue, as everything you hear has only one witness... Perhaps as an option?

Besides Grey Press, the ability to force Ready on Retreats/Builds (like in Rulebook press) but for FullPress would greatly speed up games.
Enriador (1451 D (B))
30 Apr 18 UTC
(+1)
I really like the proposed changes to points! webDip points, while an interesting experience, don't do their job as well as vDip points do.

Is it really necessary to add variable weight to bets? A simplistic system would be having a single, permanent weight for every game(10% maybe); those who do not want to risk points can play Unrated.

Let's face it, there won't be many people who will double the weight of the points in play... Most likely people will cast it down, so why bother?
G-Man (2290 D)
30 Apr 18 UTC
Re. sending press to multiple countries: As you allude Enriador, this is a legal maneuver in the Diplomacy rulebook, so in my opinion, if possible, should be the default setting with non-multiple player press being the option. Personally, I don't see any difference in the nature of triple or more alliances, intrigue... and have played both ways for decades. Sometimes you want more than one witness! (as you can always send individual press when you don't). And it's also very helpful in the larger games, where you want to discuss things with many players and don't want to have to cut, tailor, and paste text for each player in what is being discussed among a group of players.
Enriador (1451 D (B))
30 Apr 18 UTC
Good points. I think it should definitively be an option. Every major Dip place do that, with the exception of webDip/vDip...
Retillion (2221 D (B))
01 May 18 UTC
@ G-Man : Grey Press would have no value at all because anybody could write anything.
Retillion (2221 D (B))
01 May 18 UTC
@ Enriador : The ability to force Ready on Retreats/Builds would indeed speed up games but is that always a good thing ? Most of us have a family, a job, studies, travel and really appreciate sometimes that the game does not go too fast. We already have the ability to Ready our orders : if we don't, it means that we need that the game does not go that fast.

Also, the ability to force Ready on Retreats/Builds would also lead to mistakes due to technical parameters. For example, I always enter my orders one by one, so that I can check on the preview map that they were correctly recorded and so that I can see on the preview map that they really are what I want. Additionally, the ability to force Ready on Retreats/Builds would also lead to mistakes due to wrong maneuvers, for example a misclick.

Finally, the ability to force Ready on Retreats/Builds would cause that those who do not want that the game goes that fast enter their orders later in the Phase and that would lead to more NMRs.
Enriador (1451 D (B))
01 May 18 UTC
@Retillion, you make excellent points, but I ask for an *option*.

Those who dislike Rulebook press' automatic Ready-up could simply move on with their lives.
kaner406 (1430 D Mod (B) (B))
01 May 18 UTC
@Retillion re: Grey Press

That's precisely the point, anyone can write to anyone without certain knowledge that it is coming from you. I can think of a variety of reasons why I might like to use this ability in sending anonymous information to third parties etc.
@Retillion - No one is holding a gun to your head. Just don't start or join rulebook press games.
Retillion (2221 D (B))
01 May 18 UTC
@kaner406 :

I understand that you would want to send anonymous press, but let's try to see it the other way : would you care at all about any anonymous intel sent by you ? I wouldn't. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't even read it.
Retillion (2221 D (B))
01 May 18 UTC
One more thing about Grey Press : some players already allow themselves to be rude in their press. Allowing players to send anonymous messages would only make it worse.
Retillion (2221 D (B))
01 May 18 UTC
(+1)
@ YCHTT :

You are of course right. But sometimes options become the norm and eventually become mandatory.

For example, five years ago, a conversation started about an alternate scoring system : threadID=38097

By that time, I said that an alternate scoring system would change the way players would play their games. Nobody cared about what I wrote and a new system appeared : the vpoints. A few years later, some of the strongest players of this site left it because it became impossible for them to play rated games because they were systematically targetted because the more vpoints an eliminate player has, the more vpoints surviving players are rewarded.

I think that it is important to think and to discuss about the consequences of implementing options that might seem nice at first sight but that could eventually lead to disastrous effects. And that word is not too strong : when a community loses some of its strongets members, I call it a disaster.
G-Man (2290 D)
01 May 18 UTC
Re. Grey press +1 Kaner

This is generally not something you play all the time Retillion, but a nice added option that can be used as a variant of any game. So again, you don't have to join a grey press game if this is not for you. But that's a good point about rudeness and grey press games would definitely run a risk of a higher degree of rudeness. Personally, I think we should have something like a three strikes policy anyway for players that are reported who are abusive, overly vulgar, highly inappropriate... but I've raised this with the mods before and seem to be in the minority on this one.
But the difference, Retillion, is that rated games were already the norm in the form of dPoints as well. And so that side effect came about. Plus rated games are a necessity to get dPoints ot play in more games.

Rulebook Press is not a requirement nor will it ever be.
Retillion (2221 D (B))
01 May 18 UTC
@ YCHTT :

Playing with dpoints did not cause the problem that I have described : with dpoints, you gain points thanks to result of the game regardless of who is in the game, which is not the case with vpoints.

And what you just wrote proves my point, in the sense that something, whether it is an option or a norm, can lead to something else : first, there were dpoints (whose main purpose was initially to prevent beginners from joining too many games), and later, there was something much worse, the vpoints, because players were using dpoints as an unsatisfactory means of recognition of their ability to play the game well.

What I am saying is that one should not implement too fast a novelty before seriously considering the consequences of implementing it.

Finally, you never know if an option will ever become the norm or even something mandatory. Forever is a long time...
Mercy (2043 D)
01 May 18 UTC
Interesting discussion. Let me give my two cents.

@Oli
I had indeed noticed that newer players got that reminder. I think it is a very useful feature and that is why I, in fact, had suggested it for webDiplomacy (http://webdiplomacy.net/contrib/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=364).
Getting rid of dPoints is something I hadn't considered before, but I'd say that I like the idea! They don't have any real use anyway, so why not get rid of them indeed.
I dislike the idea of users being able to adjust the weight of games regarding vRanking, though. Let me explain. If you are new to the site or your skill level changes, your vRanking will converge to a point at which it is a good indicator for your skill, and then oscillate around that value. You want the convergence to go as fast as possible, but you want the oscillations to be as small as possible. In the current situation, there is a certain impact factor that games have on your vRanking. The higher the impact factor, the faster the convergence, but the bigger the oscillations, too, so one has to find some good balance for this impact factor. Finding the right balance is already difficult, but if you allow users to tweak the impact factor for different games as well, then you only increase the problems. Let me illustrate with two examples.
Let us take a look at the games played of user 00matthew2000 (http://vdiplomacy.net/hof.php?userID=5634). At some point, he won a WWIV WTA game and got awarded 1272 vPoints. After that, he was clearly above his equilibrium, as he slowly began losing vPoints after the completion of this game. The same thing happened to the other site member that once won a WWIV WTA game, cypeg, and similar things happen frequently on smaller scales (these were just extreme examples). If one wants to maximize ones own vRanking, the best strategy seems to be to just not play any ranked games after a large victory. This is already not ideal. Now imagine that 00matthews game had double weight and he got awarded 2544 points. Imagine that.
But it is not that I argue for a decrease in overall weight per se. Take a look at the games played of Retillion (http://vdiplomacy.net/hof.php?userID=2625). He never lost anything and his vPoints do not seem to have reached their equilibrium. Hence, I think that his vRanking underestimates his true skill. Now imagine that he played many games with less weight...
TLDR: Ranking is already troublesome without allowing players to mess with it even more in their game settings.
Also, I just don't see any advantage of allowing players to tweak this. Is there really someone who would want to have this option? Why not just stay with the two options Ranked and Unranked?

@sending press to multiple players
I think that option would be nice and I would probably use it if it were available, but I wouldn't prioritize it.

@grey press
I don't think that adds anything to the game. Like Retillion said, grey press would be of almost no value since it can be written by anyone (I wouldn't trust a message from a source that purposefully chooses to be anonymous); and on top of that, it would allow players to use abusive language more.

@rulebook press and forcing a ready
I pretty much agree with the points Retillion raised. I'd like to add that I personally find Rulebook Press a bit silly: the reason that there are no negotiation phases during builds and retreats in the board game is because that way, the build and retreat phases can me made shorter, and that speeds up the game; but that does not apply to online play.

@Retillions last two posts
I think you make very good points. I have never followed a discussion on vPoints, but I noticed myself by looking at the way vRanking worked that if you draw, you get more vPoints the worse the vRanking of the other players in the draw is. That apparently caused players to stop in the past? Well, I am glad that I play anonymous games only.
I agree that the vRanking system could use improvements. It won't be easy, though. The challenge is making an ELO-like rating system that does not incentivice players of certain rankings to play certain variants. Maybe I could take a look at it in the summer if people want that. When Oli made the thread you linked (10 days after I registered on this site!), he asked for math experts, and I wasn't back then, but I am starting to become it now.
Also, good point that the existence of features/options can have negative impacts even on players who don't use/care about these features/options. As an example, in the old days on webDiplomacy, PPSC scoring was standard, while it (thankfully) doesn't exist there anymore. Sometimes, though, a player of the old days makes a comeback and throws a game because he or she doesn't know any better. As such, the mere existence of the option of PPSC scoring in the past has a negative impact on the present.
Retillion - vPoints and dPoints are tied together though. You can't gain one without risking both. Therein lies the flaw of the system and why the comparison is invalid to press types.
Caerus (1650 D)
01 May 18 UTC
I am very confused by this discussion. Isn't there already a Grey press variant that does exactly what you are suggesting? Also, why did this thread become a discussion of "You should add this feature" when the great and powerful Oli was just asking for a bit of prose?
Anon (?? D)
01 May 18 UTC
Crap! I should have sent the above post anonymously.... Such a wasted opportunity....

gameID=33788
G-Man (2290 D)
01 May 18 UTC
BTW, great job on the Press definitions Mercy!
I don't believe we have Grey press in games, Caerus. Of course I could be wrong. And you're right that this thread got off track.
Caerus (1650 D)
01 May 18 UTC
Sorry, YCHTT. I see where I was confused. I think you are wanting the option of grey press on any map. I was remembering the Classic variant that has the feature built in: variantID=50.
Caerus (1650 D)
01 May 18 UTC
Huh... Varient IDs don’t work the same as Game IDs... oops.


34 replies
Siagas (1822 D)
17 Apr 18 UTC
Looking for replacement quickly
Looking for replacements in the following game : Public WWIV
http://www.vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=33046

You would play as Egypt in the map World War IV. This game is Public Press so everything you say everyone can see. For more detail, go look the new message in the thread.
8 replies
Open
ubercacher16 (1491 D)
30 Apr 18 UTC
Replacement needed
I need a replacement for China in the bourse game.
2 replies
Open
islefan5 (968 D)
28 Apr 18 UTC
Problem: cannot set orders
I have the message “loading order” but cannot enter any orders. Is the site down?
7 replies
Open
Anon (?? D)
08 Mar 18 UTC
New Variant: 1913
1913 is a revision of the Classic map, having both balance and historical accuracy at its heart.

The first game is live! http://vdiplomacy.com/board.php?gameID=34011
16 replies
Open
Sky_Hopper (829 D)
04 Apr 18 UTC
(+1)
Imbalanced map?
It seems as if several maps need some balancing work. For example, England* v Turkey is skewed toward England, and in Rinascimento, the French are virtually at the hands of other players’ wills.
11 replies
Open
Safari (1510 D (B))
05 Jan 18 UTC
(+1)
Austrian Succession: New and Improved
After four years, War of Austrian Succession is nearing completion! Please come help test it so that I can perfect the balance.
It would be very helpful if we could have no NMRs for the first few phases. http://lab.diplomail.ru/board.php?gameID=64
38 replies
Open
gopher27 (1226 D Mod)
23 Apr 18 UTC
War of Austrian Succession....being obnoxious
Does history matter and should it fall to a mathematician to be the history nerd?
11 replies
Open
CCR (1668 D)
12 Dec 17 UTC
A Reconquista variant
http://www.variantbank.org/results/rules/i/iberian.htm
38 replies
Open
stephan (1068 D)
16 Apr 18 UTC
Vermont needed!
Vermont in „the trump effect“ 50 states game has been basically abandoned and is still in its (characteristically) stronk position, but not for much longer. grab while supplies last!
3 replies
Open
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