yeah, however don`t expect to much from the opening game. Since I made the number up on the spot when writing the rules, based on what I thought would work.

They may need adjusting based on the results of the opening game.

Governments:
1. Captainmeme
2. gman314

Creditors:
1. Butterhead
2. tobi1

Of course, there may be some adjustments, but in my opinion the idea is great.

You can sign me up as a government

Governments:
1. Captainmeme
2. gman314
3. amisond

Creditors:
1. Butterhead
2. tobi1

thought I would give this a bump since its fallen off the first page

I would love to give it a go fasces, but I am snowed under with all the PMs I have to juggle with Bourse, as well as with regular games that are unrelated. sorry.

Since this is a test run i wouldn't mind using a smaller map, maybe south america (if we get 1 or 2 more governments, but I would rather more then just 2 creditors...)

ill play just PM me

as a creditor or government?

Atom desires to lead a nation through economic peril. May Capitalism never die!

Governments:
1. Captainmeme
2. gman314
3. amisond
4. King Atom?

Creditors:
1. Butterhead
2. tobi1

I've recently decided to slowly get off this site, so I won't be playing this game. Sorry.
Governments:
1. Captainmeme
2. amisond
3. King Atom?

Creditors:
1. Butterhead
2. tobi1

Ill be a Government if someone can explain to me everything a government can do. In simple word's.

Governments play the normal game with the added restriction of requiring a certain amount of money for each unit (both building and maintaining). The catch is that one center does not provide enough money to buy a new unit. So, you have to get extra money by borrowing it. One way to get money is by borrowing it from other (also poor) governments. The other way is through selling Victory Bonds. So, you will advertise how much money you need (in thousand dollar bonds) and the Creditors will buy these. The way they will buy these is by making bids to Fasces. In their bids, they will specify the bonds they want (country and number) as well as the interest they expect to receive. Fasces will grant them bids based on the lowest interest rates. The governments will then get money, but will also have to pay interest back to investors based on whatever rate they got. The bonds also have a term (I think 5 years) over which they mature. At the end of that term, the governments have to pay back the value of the bond.
For example, let's say you as a government ask for $2000. (It's small for game purposes, but it will work for now). That means that you will sell 2 bonds. Now suppose that there are 3 creditors willing to buy your bonds. Let's call them A, B and C. Creditor A has quite a bit of cash and thinks you're doing pretty well so he's willing to buy both bonds. He tells Fasces this and decides that he'll ask for 7% interest, because he wants one of the lowest rates, but he also wants to make as much money as possible off the investment. Creditor B can only afford one bond from you and he decides that he wants 5% interest. Creditor C also can only afford one bond but wants 10% interest. So Fasces, on your behalf, accepts the lowest 2 bond offers. B has the lowest interest rate so he gets one bond of $1000 at 5% interest. The next lowest is A's rate of 7% so he gets the one remaining bond, even though he asked for two. So, your country has raised $2000. But, at the end of each year, you pay interest. This comes to $50 to B and $70 to C. Then, at the end of the 5 year bond, you pay back your loan. So, $1000 to each B and C. So, for your $2000 you paid the original back as well as paying $120 in interest in each of 5 years. So, you end up paying $2600. But, you probably got more than that out of the conquests financed with your loan.

For more details, read the full rules.

I want to be a nation, by the way. It looks like more of a challenge.

I'm back to disagree...

"Imo, a major problen is going to be the 10 year maturation on bonds. In classic by 1911, typically 3 or 4 powers are eliminated akready. so by the time 1901 bonds mature, half of them are useless. This isnt even considering bonds from 1903 or 1904."
That is true, maybe 5 years would be better, with semi-anual dividends so players can redeem more of thier potential losses

This is fine! It is possibpe that investors will be very careful in 1901 and wait until they have some idea of who to invest in before committing any large amount of funding - thus players will have a tough time raising funds for a few years due to investor confidence; on the other hand any investor can make good bets early and diversify to make sure that some of their loans will be paid back. A ten year term is fine with a slower game (where players have to limit their growth based on what they can actually build, it will likely to longer to expand and ten years could have 6 powers still around - the speed partly depends on how much the investors have to risk at the start...)

Secondly i have a question - in my example of italy taking tunis in 1901, does italy raise the $15k in 1901(winter) or have to wait a year until the next build phase (ie do you raise taxation before you claim new supply centers or after? My inclination is tO suggest before)

Thirdly - i definitely reccomend playing the classic map, it is well known with many more tacticaly articles written about it than any other variant - this makes it a better control for experimental purposes; for tweaking after it is more useful.(and we can easily find more players via webdip)

Lastly, a comment on tactics, because of the immense cost of raising an army, destroying your enemies armies is more damaging than in the usual game. Also with less units on the board it becomes more difficult to destroy enemy units.

For investors, 10% per year on a ten year bond is 200% (that is, you get you full investment back plus you get the total investment in interest) even if the country defaults in 1907, you've earned 70% of your investment back, with only a 30% loss. So, take a risk by lending to 2/3 countries and losing 30% to each while you gain 200% from one good investment still leaves you with a net profit - think about the big picture.

Ps: i think i can play as either investor or govt.

I'd play as a creditor.

Governments:
1. Captainmeme
2. amisond
3. King Atom
4. fuzzyhartle1

Creditors:
1. Butterhead
2. tobi1
3. Qwit

With that in mind, I am putting bonds back at 10 years, this is a test run so we might as well stick with that, and ora makes some good points.

As for whether to play classic or some other variant, the issue with classic is we lack players. We could play ClassicVS and make it a 5 player game (we wouldn't include Germany and Italy, if you played on webdiplomacy years ago (back when it was called PHP diplomacy, not webdiplomacy), and not enough players joined, Italy and Germany would be removed from the game, now you need all 7 players to play.

Thoughts?

7-players is the ideal, but with the bourse game ongoing and many players no longer having the time, we may not be able to get there.

You missed Orathaic off your list.

Anyhow, I think it takes quite a lot out of the game to remove two nations, but of course if we can't get 7 governments then we'll have to. I would say, though, that it gives Austria and France a considerable advantage if those countries have no holding units - could 2 accounts be created which would just hold for those two if we can't get enough players?

ok. I get how to play. How much does one army cost?

nvm I get how to play now. I just need to learn how to sel Bond's hha

What happens if a country defaults and what circumstances does a country need to be in to do so?

Sign me up as a creditor

"You missed Orathaic off your list."
Ora signed up for both, so I am waiting to see which list needs more players when the game starts before adding him.

"nvm I get how to play now. I just need to learn how to sel Bond's hha "
In the autumn phase, PM me how much money you need to raise from bonds, thats all you need to do (however it is up to you to determine how much money you need)

"Anyhow, I think it takes quite a lot out of the game to remove two nations, but of course if we can't get 7 governments then we'll have to. I would say, though, that it gives Austria and France a considerable advantage if those countries have no holding units - could 2 accounts be created which would just hold for those two if we can't get enough players?"
That is true, I think that can be arranged. (I would have to confirm with Oli)

Governments:
1. Captainmeme
2. amisond
3. King Atom
4. fuzzyhartle1

Creditors:
1. Butterhead
2. tobi1
3. Qwit
4. Shep315

sorr I had a few typo's hahaha. Okay I get how to sell bond's if that's how simple it is.

however just one thing, it has to be a round number, don't ask to raise something like $3857, just ask for $4000, lol

and I didn't notice to typo's lol

I meant to say Sell and haha

I assume rules for defaults are simple, you don't default if you can avoid it because no investors will lend to you if you are a known defaulter. Extensions or changes in interest rates can be negotiated if investors wish, but taxation provides of occupied provinces provides half the income needed to supply your units (assuming you raised them all with debt) so defaulting could result in serious deteriation of your standing force (unless you are only holding your own home centers)